My sons 99 Miata is due for a oil change and filter….We would like to use synthetic oil as the warranty just ran out….Any one know of any reason why we should not use this oil?…..Any thoughts on long life filters?….(I was doing a job at a BMW dealers garage one day and I noticed all the late model cars were getting Mobil 1 put in there crankcase so I asked the mechanic why and he said at the time BMW was giving free oil changes every 7500 miles and filters every 15000 and that BMW put in the Mobile1 because of the length of the intervals, was this true?)
I use Mobil 1 and only change it about every 5,000. I also use the Mobil 1 oil filters.
Avartar wrote in message …
My sons 99 Miata is due for a oil change and filter….We would like to use synthetic oil as the warranty just ran out….Any one know of any reason why we should not use this oil?…..Any thoughts on long life filters?….(I was doing a job at a BMW dealers garage one day and I noticed all the late model cars were getting Mobil 1 put in there crankcase so I asked the mechanic why and he said at the time BMW was giving free oil changes every 7500 miles and filters every 15000 and that BMW put in the Mobile1 because of the length of the intervals, was this true?)
Begin Quote
We would like to use synthetic oil as the warranty just ran out….Any
one know of any reason why we should not use this oil?…..Any thoughts
on long life filters?….
End Quote
Well, there was little reason not to use it before the warranty ran
out. But then unless your Miata is turbo or super charged there is
little reason to use it.
Yes synthetic oils are better. The point I wish to make is that
regular oils are great. They are much better than they were 30 years
ago and you really don’t get any real gain from synthetic. It is like
using high test gas in your Miata.
For the sake of your car I would not believe all that is said by the
sellers of synthetic oils and their ability to extend oil changes as far
as some suggest.
Also for the sake of your Miata, if you really like it, use the
original filters. They don’t cost all that much. Oil and filters are
really cheap in the long run. Those "super" filters have never been
proven to me to be better (and I have seen a number of reports that at
least some are below standards) so I would stay away from them.
–
Dia ‘s Muire duit
Joe M
You are right about not really needing synth, except if you drive in the
winter, startups are much easier as synth doesn’t thicken in the cold.
Plenty of research (oil analysis) that shows that synth IS good for at
LEAST 10,000 miles. Most dump it then even though testing shows it’s still
fine, can’t get past that mental block of NEEDING to change it!
Joseph Meehan <sligo…@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:MkQN6.155648$BB5.2347129@typhoon.columbus.rr.com…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> Begin Quote
> We would like to use synthetic oil as the warranty just ran out….Any
> one know of any reason why we should not use this oil?…..Any thoughts
> on long life filters?….
> End Quote
> Well, there was little reason not to use it before the warranty ran
> out. But then unless your Miata is turbo or super charged there is
> little reason to use it.
> Yes synthetic oils are better. The point I wish to make is that
> regular oils are great. They are much better than they were 30 years
> ago and you really don’t get any real gain from synthetic. It is like
> using high test gas in your Miata.
> For the sake of your car I would not believe all that is said by the
> sellers of synthetic oils and their ability to extend oil changes as far
> as some suggest.
> Also for the sake of your Miata, if you really like it, use the
> original filters. They don’t cost all that much. Oil and filters are
> really cheap in the long run. Those "super" filters have never been
> proven to me to be better (and I have seen a number of reports that at
> least some are below standards) so I would stay away from them.
> —
> Dia ‘s Muire duit
> Joe M
Begin Quote
Plenty of research (oil analysis) that shows that synth IS good for
at LEAST 10,000 miles.
End Quote
So what did the same exact test say about standard oils? And what
is the cost comparison?
–
Dia ‘s Muire duit
Joe M
wasn’t any "comparison" test. Just guys in charge of fleets of vehicles or
very interested single car owners paying to have the oil analyzed. The big
difference is in the acids produced in the oil as a by product of the
combustion process. Those just don’t get made in synthetics.
Joseph Meehan <sligo…@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3CVN6.155694$BB5.2365436@typhoon.columbus.rr.com…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> Begin Quote
> Plenty of research (oil analysis) that shows that synth IS good for
> at LEAST 10,000 miles.
> End Quote
> So what did the same exact test say about standard oils? And what
> is the cost comparison?
> —
> Dia ‘s Muire duit
> Joe M
Begin Quote
The big difference is in the acids produced in the oil as a by product
of the combustion process. Those just don’t get made in synthetics.
End Quote
Anyone car to comment on this one????
–
Dia ‘s Muire duit
Joe M
Check it out, interesting site.
Marc
http://www.geocities.com/chrislonghurst/enginegoil_bible.html
This link will work if you remove the second "G" in engineoil
Larry Kime and Lil Bit
"Marc in Oz" <dingo…@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:8cZN6.84$hV3.2283@newsfeeds.bigpond.com…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> Check it out, interesting site.
> Marc
> http://www.geocities.com/chrislonghurst/enginegoil_bible.html
Sorry, typing mistake..
http://www.geocities.com/chrislonghurst/engineoil_bible.html
Marc in Oz <dingo…@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:8cZN6.84$hV3.2283@newsfeeds.bigpond.com…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> Check it out, interesting site.
> Marc
> http://www.geocities.com/chrislonghurst/enginegoil_bible.html
I use Mobil 1 and only change it about every 5,000. I also use the Mobil 1
oil filters.
Me too……….
Me three
Mike Muth <muth1…@dsport.com> wrote in message
news:dD_N6.5903$DW1.261079@iad-read.news.verio.net…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> I use Mobil 1 and only change it about every 5,000. I also use the Mobil 1
> oil filters.
> Me too……….
Do some reading, the info is out there.
Joseph Meehan <sligo…@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:YFXN6.155718$BB5.2371890@typhoon.columbus.rr.com…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> Begin Quote
> The big difference is in the acids produced in the oil as a by product
> of the combustion process. Those just don’t get made in synthetics.
> End Quote
> Anyone car to comment on this one????
> —
> Dia ‘s Muire duit
> Joe M
Mobil 1! Your car will love you for it. You can lengthen the change
interval, that is up to you though. I change mine every 5000 and the
filter every time. Just two opinionated reccomendations.. 10w-30 Mobil 1
or castrol syntec (these are the only two i have good data on brand
wise) and never use FRAM oil filters. Cut one open.. they are junk
inside. Even the autozone detsch in the grey box is better.. (even john
force does not use a fram.. just makes their commercials..). I have
gotten good data from tests done on the mobil 1 filter too, granted they
cost a bit more but it’s up to you!
Avartar wrote:
> My sons 99 Miata is due for a oil change and filter….We would like
> to use synthetic oil as the warranty just ran out….Any one know of
> any reason why we should not use this oil?…..Any thoughts on long
> life filters?….(I was doing a job at a BMW dealers garage one day
> and I noticed all the late model cars were getting Mobil 1 put in
> there crankcase so I asked the mechanic why and he said at the time
> BMW was giving free oil changes every 7500 miles and filters every
> 15000 and that BMW put in the Mobile1 because of the length of the
> intervals, was this true?)
–
ÐÏ à¡± á
As far as the sythetic oils not being proven i beg to differ. My 93 has
80,000 on it with sythetic in since 30,000 miles ans the inside of the
engine is spotless, no sludge at all, none. Every time I drain the oil it’s
color is nearly like it went in, not black like a conventional oil
(carbonization). I have studied all the test data I could find and it is an
overwhelming difference. The film strenght is incredible and there is much
less zinc, ash and other dino oil bad stuff. I am not one for "snake oils"
so i looked and studied to make sure the claims were not bunk. I even got
data from the oil company engineers (lotsa e mails to get those). I also run
sythetic in my 66 jeep and my 96 cherokee with great results. Some home
tests I ran were also helpful. After driving the same circuit two different
times in a friends car first with conventional oil (halvoline 10-w30) we
took oil pan temp with a fluke 51 (very accurate to .1F) and then again with
10w30 mobil 1, there was a 30F difference. As far as filters the only "super
filter" that i have seen any real data on is the mobil and it was a bit
better than the rest as far as filtering properties however d/p suffered a
bit.. (differential pressure, inlet – outlet). I use the autozone deutsch
filters as they tested well in filtration, burst and good internal
construction. Those are made by um…. damn can’t remember the name but they
also make STP and a few other brands (just painted different). I could go on
forever about oils… but… Oh i forgot to mention that I am also a turbine
engineer.. so i am well versed in lubrication theory…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Joseph Meehan wrote:
> Begin Quote
> We would like to use synthetic oil as the warranty just ran out….Any
> one know of any reason why we should not use this oil?…..Any thoughts
> on long life filters?….
> End Quote
> Well, there was little reason not to use it before the warranty ran
> out. But then unless your Miata is turbo or super charged there is
> little reason to use it.
> Yes synthetic oils are better. The point I wish to make is that
> regular oils are great. They are much better than they were 30 years
> ago and you really don’t get any real gain from synthetic. It is like
> using high test gas in your Miata.
> For the sake of your car I would not believe all that is said by the
> sellers of synthetic oils and their ability to extend oil changes as far
> as some suggest.
> Also for the sake of your Miata, if you really like it, use the
> original filters. They don’t cost all that much. Oil and filters are
> really cheap in the long run. Those "super" filters have never been
> proven to me to be better (and I have seen a number of reports that at
> least some are below standards) so I would stay away from them.
> —
> Dia ‘s Muire duit
> Joe M
–
ÐÏ à¡± á
One of the tests i followed was by a college done on a fleet of cabs, the
cars with the sythetic oil that they ran for 15,000 miles was was still in
better shape than the dino oil cars dumped at 3,000. There were less
contaminants (better ringsealing), less carbonic acid buildup, better
emulsibility, and less sludge (ash and zinc as well as carbon.).
Joseph Meehan wrote:
> Begin Quote
> Plenty of research (oil analysis) that shows that synth IS good for
> at LEAST 10,000 miles.
> End Quote
> So what did the same exact test say about standard oils? And what
> is the cost comparison?
> —
> Dia ‘s Muire duit
> Joe M
–
ÐÏ à¡± á
Ed Hackett is the fella that worte the article i posted in this thread.. he said
it much better than i ever could have.. his article is wonderful and definately
better than my ramblings.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
"Scott L. Liechti" wrote:
> As far as the sythetic oils not being proven i beg to differ. My 93 has
> 80,000 on it with sythetic in since 30,000 miles ans the inside of the
> engine is spotless, no sludge at all, none. Every time I drain the oil it’s
> color is nearly like it went in, not black like a conventional oil
> (carbonization). I have studied all the test data I could find and it is an
> overwhelming difference. The film strenght is incredible and there is much
> less zinc, ash and other dino oil bad stuff. I am not one for "snake oils"
> so i looked and studied to make sure the claims were not bunk. I even got
> data from the oil company engineers (lotsa e mails to get those). I also run
> sythetic in my 66 jeep and my 96 cherokee with great results. Some home
> tests I ran were also helpful. After driving the same circuit two different
> times in a friends car first with conventional oil (halvoline 10-w30) we
> took oil pan temp with a fluke 51 (very accurate to .1F) and then again with
> 10w30 mobil 1, there was a 30F difference. As far as filters the only "super
> filter" that i have seen any real data on is the mobil and it was a bit
> better than the rest as far as filtering properties however d/p suffered a
> bit.. (differential pressure, inlet – outlet). I use the autozone deutsch
> filters as they tested well in filtration, burst and good internal
> construction. Those are made by um…. damn can’t remember the name but they
> also make STP and a few other brands (just painted different). I could go on
> forever about oils… but… Oh i forgot to mention that I am also a turbine
> engineer.. so i am well versed in lubrication theory…
> Joseph Meehan wrote:
> > Begin Quote
> > We would like to use synthetic oil as the warranty just ran out….Any
> > one know of any reason why we should not use this oil?…..Any thoughts
> > on long life filters?….
> > End Quote
> > Well, there was little reason not to use it before the warranty ran
> > out. But then unless your Miata is turbo or super charged there is
> > little reason to use it.
> > Yes synthetic oils are better. The point I wish to make is that
> > regular oils are great. They are much better than they were 30 years
> > ago and you really don’t get any real gain from synthetic. It is like
> > using high test gas in your Miata.
> > For the sake of your car I would not believe all that is said by the
> > sellers of synthetic oils and their ability to extend oil changes as far
> > as some suggest.
> > Also for the sake of your Miata, if you really like it, use the
> > original filters. They don’t cost all that much. Oil and filters are
> > really cheap in the long run. Those "super" filters have never been
> > proven to me to be better (and I have seen a number of reports that at
> > least some are below standards) so I would stay away from them.
> > —
> > Dia ‘s Muire duit
> > Joe M
> —
> ÐÏ à¡±
–
ÐÏ à¡± á
We are convinced……….Thanks for all the input!
"Avartar" <Avar…@adelphia.net> wrote in message news:V6PN6.827$BY.4056140@news2.news.adelphia.net…
My sons 99 Miata is due for a oil change and filter….We would like to use synthetic oil as the warranty just ran out….Any one know of any reason why we should not use this oil?…..Any thoughts on long life filters?….(I was doing a job at a BMW dealers garage one day and I noticed all the late model cars were getting Mobil 1 put in there crankcase so I asked the mechanic why and he said at the time BMW was giving free oil changes every 7500 miles and filters every 15000 and that BMW put in the Mobile1 because of the length of the intervals, was this true?)
Begin Quote
Oh i forgot to mention that I am also a turbine engineer.. so i am well
versed in lubrication theory…
End Quote
Again I repeat, other than tubo/super charged engines there is
little or no reason to use synthetic oils. As I also said, they are
better, but the point is you don’t need better. Just how many of
today’s standard automobile engines which have the prescribed oil
changes, suffer oil related problems?
Sure if the stuff was the same price, I would opt for the synthetic
oil, but for over 90% of the drivers out there it is just overkill.
Now when you start talking about many of the so called oil improves
etc. on the market, I would have to say they are a complete waste of
money and in some cases actuarially cause problems. In this respect I
synthetic is far different.
Maybe I missed something, but I don’t see where we disagree.
–
Dia ‘s Muire duit
Joe M
Upon reading his posts he _does_ provide the reason why synth is better than
dino. The benefit is for N/A also, in fact, the data that was presented was
based on standard N/A engines [I don't beleive they turbocharge taxis
]. Further the cost difference is balanced out by an increased interval for
syth. The other point on the interval that was made was that for most
commuters the typical engine use would fall under "severe" due to stop and
go and less than 10 miles driven. If I take an engineers opinion as well
informed and in the area of his speciality, then the real interval for most
would be 3000 miles dino, or longer (5000 miles) with synth. Both intervals
are sooner than Mazda recommends. I do not beleive that Mazda’s
reccommendation are based solely on lubrication (ie. marketing, 36000 mile
warranty, etc). I want my engine to last much longer than Mazda does.
I never used sythetic and never saw the benefit for the cost. But, based on
what I read, I am now going to change over to synthetic. I will be using
the 5000 mile interval.
BrianW
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Joseph Meehan wrote:
> Begin Quote
> Oh i forgot to mention that I am also a turbine engineer.. so i am well
> versed in lubrication theory…
> End Quote
> Again I repeat, other than tubo/super charged engines there is
> little or no reason to use synthetic oils. As I also said, they are
> better, but the point is you don’t need better. Just how many of
> today’s standard automobile engines which have the prescribed oil
> changes, suffer oil related problems?
> Sure if the stuff was the same price, I would opt for the synthetic
> oil, but for over 90% of the drivers out there it is just overkill.
> Now when you start talking about many of the so called oil improves
> etc. on the market, I would have to say they are a complete waste of
> money and in some cases actuarially cause problems. In this respect I
> synthetic is far different.
> Maybe I missed something, but I don’t see where we disagree.
> —
> Dia ‘s Muire duit
> Joe M
THe one negative for synth is the run off of parts by the "slipperier"
synth. IF the car sits long enough, it runs off and doesn’t suffieciently
lubricate at startup.
Have seen it stated many times ("I" don’t know if it’s a fact) that synth
has been banned in aircraft engines for that specific reason. They are
incredibly stringent on rebuild specs, so they shoud know. FWIW
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
<b…@pacifier.com> wrote in message news:3B0A7A38.2FB67B93@pacifier.com…
> Upon reading his posts he _does_ provide the reason why synth is better
than
> dino. The benefit is for N/A also, in fact, the data that was presented
was
> based on standard N/A engines [I don't beleive they turbocharge taxis
> ]. Further the cost difference is balanced out by an increased interval
for
> syth. The other point on the interval that was made was that for most
> commuters the typical engine use would fall under "severe" due to stop and
> go and less than 10 miles driven. If I take an engineers opinion as well
> informed and in the area of his speciality, then the real interval for
most
> would be 3000 miles dino, or longer (5000 miles) with synth. Both
intervals
> are sooner than Mazda recommends. I do not beleive that Mazda’s
> reccommendation are based solely on lubrication (ie. marketing, 36000 mile
> warranty, etc). I want my engine to last much longer than Mazda does.
> I never used sythetic and never saw the benefit for the cost. But, based
on
> what I read, I am now going to change over to synthetic. I will be using
> the 5000 mile interval.
> BrianW
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Joseph Meehan wrote:
> > Begin Quote
> > Oh i forgot to mention that I am also a turbine engineer.. so i am well
> > versed in lubrication theory…
> > End Quote
> > Again I repeat, other than tubo/super charged engines there is
> > little or no reason to use synthetic oils. As I also said, they are
> > better, but the point is you don’t need better. Just how many of
> > today’s standard automobile engines which have the prescribed oil
> > changes, suffer oil related problems?
> > Sure if the stuff was the same price, I would opt for the synthetic
> > oil, but for over 90% of the drivers out there it is just overkill.
> > Now when you start talking about many of the so called oil improves
> > etc. on the market, I would have to say they are a complete waste of
> > money and in some cases actuarially cause problems. In this respect I
> > synthetic is far different.
> > Maybe I missed something, but I don’t see where we disagree.
> > —
> > Dia ‘s Muire duit
> > Joe M
"Upon reading his posts he _does_ provide the reason why synth is better
than dino. "
Sorry I still don’t see it.
"Further the cost difference is balanced out by an increased interval
for syth. "
I did not see anything indicating the test results were for based on
extended change intervals.
"The other point on the interval that was made was that for most
commuters the typical engine use would fall under "severe" due to stop
and go and less than 10 miles driven. "
Where did you read that? I did not see that. Could you give a
quote?
"I want my engine to last much longer than Mazda does."
How long do you think it will last with standard oil vs. synthetic?
How did you compute the difference?
–
Dia ‘s Muire duit
Joe M
I totally agreee with the oil additives…no way no how..however when the
miata has 200K on it and the engine internals are still like new then i will
compare notes.. I guess if you do not plan on keeping a car past 100K i will
agree but as for me my maita is one to keep forever.. I can equate the extra
cost to longevity and increased oil change intervals. Also try redline MTL
synthetic in your tranny… then try to sell me on regular gear oil… i am
sure anyone in this group that has made that change will agree… I do
understand however that conventional oils are "good" oils but as usual I
want the best. Yes turbo’s do require better oils because of the increased
heat load and the incredible demand for an oil to have good
cohesion/adhesion properties to support a good oil film at over 10,000 rpm
on a turbo shaft. but even on an 1800/3600 rpm turbine shaft the commercial
power industry and the us navy all use synthetic lube oils. The commercial
power industry is in business for one thing, to make money, if it were not
cost effective for them to use synthetics then.. well that answer is
obvious. In conclusion I will state that yes conventional oils are fine and
an engine will last as designed but there is a difference between "fine" and
"extraordinary" when it comes to longevity.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Joseph Meehan wrote:
> Begin Quote
> Oh i forgot to mention that I am also a turbine engineer.. so i am well
> versed in lubrication theory…
> End Quote
> Again I repeat, other than tubo/super charged engines there is
> little or no reason to use synthetic oils. As I also said, they are
> better, but the point is you don’t need better. Just how many of
> today’s standard automobile engines which have the prescribed oil
> changes, suffer oil related problems?
> Sure if the stuff was the same price, I would opt for the synthetic
> oil, but for over 90% of the drivers out there it is just overkill.
> Now when you start talking about many of the so called oil improves
> etc. on the market, I would have to say they are a complete waste of
> money and in some cases actuarially cause problems. In this respect I
> synthetic is far different.
> Maybe I missed something, but I don’t see where we disagree.
> —
> Dia ‘s Muire duit
> Joe M
–
ÐÏ à¡± á
Someone must be making things up somewhere.. that is fiction. In order to
understand why syn is slipperier you have to look at it on a molecular level. It
is due to uniform molecule size which promotes much better laminar flow layers
and also a much stronger film strength. It also has better cohesion properties
(ability to sick to itself) which promotes a strong film and better adhesion
(ability to stick to other things) which forms the better laminar flow layers.
(if interested look up langmuirs theories of lubrication and flow). A simple
experiment will debunk these ideas of runoff.. Take a piece of glass and two
small but equal amounts of regukar and syn oil at the same temp. incline the
glass and pour the two oils in the glass near the top and watch how they flow
down the glass and which one leaves a better film and see if it "runs off" or
not. I am not sure of aircraft turbines however GE industrial gas turbines (a
large percentage of aircraft gas turbines are also GE) all use syn lube oil. I
guess it could be banned on aircraft but i don’t know for sure or why for sure..
I guess I am going to have to find out, now i am curious. If any of you have any
more info on this I would love to hear as I am very curious..
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Michael Bradbury wrote:
> THe one negative for synth is the run off of parts by the "slipperier"
> synth. IF the car sits long enough, it runs off and doesn’t suffieciently
> lubricate at startup.
> Have seen it stated many times ("I" don’t know if it’s a fact) that synth
> has been banned in aircraft engines for that specific reason. They are
> incredibly stringent on rebuild specs, so they shoud know. FWIW
> <b…@pacifier.com> wrote in message news:3B0A7A38.2FB67B93@pacifier.com…
> > Upon reading his posts he _does_ provide the reason why synth is better
> than
> > dino. The benefit is for N/A also, in fact, the data that was presented
> was
> > based on standard N/A engines [I don't beleive they turbocharge taxis
> > ]. Further the cost difference is balanced out by an increased interval
> for
> > syth. The other point on the interval that was made was that for most
> > commuters the typical engine use would fall under "severe" due to stop and
> > go and less than 10 miles driven. If I take an engineers opinion as well
> > informed and in the area of his speciality, then the real interval for
> most
> > would be 3000 miles dino, or longer (5000 miles) with synth. Both
> intervals
> > are sooner than Mazda recommends. I do not beleive that Mazda’s
> > reccommendation are based solely on lubrication (ie. marketing, 36000 mile
> > warranty, etc). I want my engine to last much longer than Mazda does.
> > I never used sythetic and never saw the benefit for the cost. But, based
> on
> > what I read, I am now going to change over to synthetic. I will be using
> > the 5000 mile interval.
> > BrianW
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > Joseph Meehan wrote:
> > > Begin Quote
> > > Oh i forgot to mention that I am also a turbine engineer.. so i am well
> > > versed in lubrication theory…
> > > End Quote
> > > Again I repeat, other than tubo/super charged engines there is
> > > little or no reason to use synthetic oils. As I also said, they are
> > > better, but the point is you don’t need better. Just how many of
> > > today’s standard automobile engines which have the prescribed oil
> > > changes, suffer oil related problems?
> > > Sure if the stuff was the same price, I would opt for the synthetic
> > > oil, but for over 90% of the drivers out there it is just overkill.
> > > Now when you start talking about many of the so called oil improves
> > > etc. on the market, I would have to say they are a complete waste of
> > > money and in some cases actuarially cause problems. In this respect I
> > > synthetic is far different.
> > > Maybe I missed something, but I don’t see where we disagree.
> > > —
> > > Dia ‘s Muire duit
> > > Joe M
–
ÐÏ à¡± á
Just as another bit of info, look under the hood of the corvette/camaro
ls-1, porsche, mercedes… all factory filled with synthetic.. hmm i wonder
if their engineers know something?
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Joseph Meehan wrote:
> "Upon reading his posts he _does_ provide the reason why synth is better
> than dino. "
> Sorry I still don’t see it.
> "Further the cost difference is balanced out by an increased interval
> for syth. "
> I did not see anything indicating the test results were for based on
> extended change intervals.
> "The other point on the interval that was made was that for most
> commuters the typical engine use would fall under "severe" due to stop
> and go and less than 10 miles driven. "
> Where did you read that? I did not see that. Could you give a
> quote?
> "I want my engine to last much longer than Mazda does."
> How long do you think it will last with standard oil vs. synthetic?
> How did you compute the difference?
> —
> Dia ‘s Muire duit
> Joe M
–
ÐÏ à¡± á
"Larry Kime" <larryki…@home.com> wrote in message
news:psKN6.47202$I5.10030073@news1.rdc1.tn.home.com…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> Lil Bit is a 97 base model miata with 50680 miles, Tonight the damn idiot
> light just came on. I notice no difference in the operation or sound of
the
> miata. everything seems to be running fine. How critical is it. should
I
> drop everything and take it to a mechanic right away or can it last to
the
> end of the month, (when I get paid next) to have it checked out. Is there
> some type of service that has to be done at 50000 miles, that triggered
the
> light, or is the car broke and in need of repair. on a similar note. how
> mush should it cost to have the Mazda dealer put the car on the machine
and
> tell me what is wrong with Lil Bit. I do not want to get ripped of by
Mazda
> just to have then tell me it is time to change the plugs or something. I
> live in the panhandle of Florida, has anyone had a good experience with a
> local mechanic, or one that they would recommend, I just don’t want to get
> ripped off.
From my experience with my other cars, as long as the car still appears to
be running good, you should be fine to wait. I’m good friends with a service
manager at a Chrysler dealership, and he told me that generally, the check
engine light indicates a problem in your exhaust or electrical system, IIRC.
Every time mine has come on in older vehicles is because of the oxygen
sensor.
> Thanks for your help
> Larry Kime and Lil Bit
–
Jake
Remove nothing to reply
I would think that someone here could tell you but my experience is that
these go off at scheduled intervals (ie; 50,000 miles) to get you to come in
and run the maintenance items suggested by the factory. Ask on the Miata
forum on miata.net I’ll bet you’ll get good info.
Dagger
92BB&T
"Larry Kime" <larryki…@home.com> wrote in message
news:psKN6.47202$I5.10030073@news1.rdc1.tn.home.com…
: Lil Bit is a 97 base model miata with 50680 miles, Tonight the damn
idiot
: light just came on. I notice no difference in the operation or sound
of the
: miata. everything seems to be running fine. How critical is it.
should I
: drop everything and take it to a mechanic right away or can it last
to the
: end of the month, (when I get paid next) to have it checked out. Is
there
: some type of service that has to be done at 50000 miles, that
triggered the
: light, or is the car broke and in need of repair. on a similar note.
how
: mush should it cost to have the Mazda dealer put the car on the
machine and
: tell me what is wrong with Lil Bit. I do not want to get ripped of by
Mazda
: just to have then tell me it is time to change the plugs or something.
I
: live in the panhandle of Florida, has anyone had a good experience
with a
: local mechanic, or one that they would recommend, I just don’t want to
get
: ripped off.
: Thanks for your help
:
: Larry Kime and Lil Bit
According to the Enthusiast’s Shop Manual, the Check Engine light
reports problems, rather than coming on at scheduled times. Since late
’95 models you need special service tools to read out the code(s),
rather than being able to get the codes yourself like on earlier
models — my ’94 reported an Oxygen Sensor problem, which is what it
turned out to be.
–
Please remove the under_scores if sending me mail.
"Larry Kime" <larryki…@home.com> made obeisance before Us and spake thusly:
>Lil Bit is a 97 base model miata with 50680 miles, Tonight the damn idiot
>light just came on.
From personal experience: Check the gas cap. Take it off, tighten it until
it clicks several times. Take off the battery cable for a few minutes and put
it back on to clear the light. If it doesn’t come back on in a few miles,
that was it.
–
Jason G
"If a child shows himself to be incorrigible, he should be decently and
quietly beheaded at the age of twelve, lest he grow to maturity, marry,
and perpetuate his kind." — Don Marquis
—–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—–
http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
—–== Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–
Jason G
You are a savior. I went out this morning and retightened the gas cap.
Started the miata and the check engine light did not come back on. I drove
over 50 miles today and it stayed off all day. thank you for your great
advise.
Larry Kime and Lil Bit
"Jason G" <jrgusenet@REMOVE_ooo_THIS_xxx_PART_yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3b087689$1_2@goliath2…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> "Larry Kime" <larryki…@home.com> made obeisance before Us and spake
thusly:
> >Lil Bit is a 97 base model miata with 50680 miles, Tonight the damn
idiot
> >light just came on.
> From personal experience: Check the gas cap. Take it off, tighten it
until
> it clicks several times. Take off the battery cable for a few minutes and
put
> it back on to clear the light. If it doesn’t come back on in a few miles,
> that was it.
> —
> Jason G
> "If a child shows himself to be incorrigible, he should be decently and
> quietly beheaded at the age of twelve, lest he grow to maturity, marry,
> and perpetuate his kind." — Don Marquis
> —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—–
> http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
> —–== Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–
Since I don’t post often, a word about my qualification to answer this
question.
I’m an engineer at one of the big three and I worked in the department that
programmed the check engine light, I’m still in powertrain development.
I am NOT speaking for that company.
The only purpose of the ‘Check Engine’ light is to notify the driver that
something is wrong with the emission control systems on the vehicle. Since
almost everything the engine does affects emissions, thats a lot of faults.
It is a legal requirement on all manufacturers, and cannot be used for other
purposes such as scheduled maintenance. All this according to EPA and CARB
regulations.
One system that is monitored is the evaporative emissions system (all the
lines that feed fuel vapors to the carbon canister and back to the engine).
Since the gas cap must be in place for this system to work correctly, we
have to turn on the light if it the cap is loose. This makes it one or our
persistent warranty items, and is the reason you may see a ‘check fuel cap’
light in newer vehicles. Even so, it is only about 5-10% of the problems in
the worst cases. If tightening the cap cleared the light after at least TWO
drive cycles (simplified thats a start, warmup, drive a little, and
cooldown) you should be good to go.
As long as the light is not flashing and there are no other symptoms, the
problem should not immediately damage the vehicle. It should be safe to
wait on repairs. You will be emitting excessively in the meantime, and may
be limited on power. NOTE, the other lights like overheat, oil, or brakes
ARE immediate issues.
Hope this helps a little.
Jeff A,
Larry Kime <larryki…@home.com> wrote in message
news:eBgO6.53739$I5.11596399@news1.rdc1.tn.home.com…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> Jason G
> You are a savior. I went out this morning and retightened the gas cap.
> Started the miata and the check engine light did not come back on. I
drove
> over 50 miles today and it stayed off all day. thank you for your great
> advise.
> Larry Kime and Lil Bit
> "Jason G" <jrgusenet@REMOVE_ooo_THIS_xxx_PART_yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:3b087689$1_2@goliath2…
> > "Larry Kime" <larryki…@home.com> made obeisance before Us and spake
> thusly:
> > >Lil Bit is a 97 base model miata with 50680 miles, Tonight the damn
> idiot
> > >light just came on.
> > From personal experience: Check the gas cap. Take it off, tighten it
> until
> > it clicks several times. Take off the battery cable for a few minutes
and
> put
> > it back on to clear the light. If it doesn’t come back on in a few
miles,
> > that was it.
> > —
> > Jason G
> > "If a child shows himself to be incorrigible, he should be decently and
> > quietly beheaded at the age of twelve, lest he grow to maturity, marry,
> > and perpetuate his kind." — Don Marquis
> > —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—–
> > http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
> > —–== Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–
"Jeffrey Anderson" wrote
> As long as the light is not flashing…
So what if the light is flashing & there aren’t any other symptoms? Could a
disconnected/severed O2 sensor line or malfunctioning O2 sensor cause that?
Just Wondering,
Sonny & "Bonnie"
STO #679 – Turbo
STO Registry – http://www.sonny2.com/
Several possible causes. The main reason we flash the light is if something
is happening to overheat/melt the catalyst like NOW. Generally a bad
misfire which leaves plenty of O2 and unburnt fuel in the exhaust which
reacts when it reaches the cat, overheating it. When detected, the system
goes tries to go to a failsafe mode, but this can be hard to manage.
O2 sensor failures that are overt, like disconnected lines, are easily
detected and the system goes to a fail safe mode. This mode is fairly easy,
just control fuel open loop and a little rich for good operation. That’s
why the emissions go up.
Jeff
Sonny <sonny…@email.com> wrote in message
news:9edn1i$9f$1@bob.news.rcn.net…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> "Jeffrey Anderson" wrote
> > As long as the light is not flashing…
> So what if the light is flashing & there aren’t any other symptoms? Could
a
> disconnected/severed O2 sensor line or malfunctioning O2 sensor cause
that?
> Just Wondering,
> Sonny & "Bonnie"
> STO #679 – Turbo
> STO Registry – http://www.sonny2.com/
Thank you for your response; you’ve helped more than you know! Our other
make has the light on now…
David Lynch
’92 black/tan
HI ALL I have a early 1990 Red . I bought some braces off a 1993 .My
mechanic said there are NO holes with threads to bolt them on the chassis
.Question 1 would it be all right to tack weld them on ??? 2 does anyone
have a manual for a 1993-4 to show me were they are suppose to go. May you
could e-mail a picture out of your manual I have a 1992 manual but they
don’t show any because they did not add the Braces till 1993. Thanks guys
& girl’s.
In article <3b15279…@oracle.zianet.com>,
"bafulmer" <baful…@zianet.com> wrote:
>HI ALL I have a early 1990 Red . I bought some braces off a 1993 .My
>mechanic said there are NO holes with threads to bolt them on the chassis
>.Question 1 would it be all right to tack weld them on ??? 2 does anyone
>have a manual for a 1993-4 to show me were they are suppose to go.
Here’s a photo that shows quite clearly where they all go:
http://members.nbci.com/villacorte/sdmc/ws2001-rollover/10.jpg
–
Lanny Chambers, St. Louis, USA
’94C
the alignment page:
http://www.hummingbirds.net/alignment.html
On Wed, 30 May 2001 17:30:43 GMT, Lanny Chambers wrote about Re: Chassis braces:
> Here’s a photo that shows quite clearly where they all go:
Love that subtle sense of humour Lanny
Great instructive photo – saved for future reference.
Although I had to stand on my head to get the reference points…
The other photos are also a good answer to the "what happens when"
question.
</Dave/Null
–
Take the Q from Canada to reply
Thanks Larry. Nice picture too bad for the Miata. Was any killed ? I hope
not.
HI ALL: Will I had my Early 1990 Miata on the rack this morning and still
could NOT find the bolt holes to bolt on the chassis braces Maybe some one
who has a 93 or younger manual could E-mail me the pages that shows where
they go on. Thanks
>still
>could NOT find the bolt holes to bolt on the chassis braces
That’s ’cause they ain’t there. Just looked at our ’90 and ’97. There’s a tab
welded to the lower a-arm attachment point on each side that accepts the rear
brace on the ’97. The ’90 doesn’t have them.
Someone posted a msg on thre miata.net forum recently commenting on buying an
aftermarket rear brace that mounts on the pivot point bolts for the lower
a-arms, requiring caution that you don’t change the alignment when installing
it.
—
Ken Lyons
’97 Touring – Brilliant Black
’90 A – Classic Red
Inside the Beltway
Without climbing under my car, my ’90 has the braces I put on 8 years ago
and the braces are connected to the car using bolts that were already there
holding suspension parts together. On the rear brace, I had to be careful
not to shift the alignment of the wheels by marking how the nuts/notches
were before I loosened the bolts for the brace. The chintzy stickers on the
brace fell off, thank goodness, so I can’t tell you who the supplier was but
it might have been ‘Wiz performance’ or something like that. Check the Miata
Markerplace at Miata.Net and see if one sells braces for an older miata.
They might have instructions. Mike
"bafulmer" <baful…@zianet.com> wrote in message
news:3b1fabae.0@oracle.zianet.com…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> HI ALL: Will I had my Early 1990 Miata on the rack this morning and still
> could NOT find the bolt holes to bolt on the chassis braces Maybe some
one
> who has a 93 or younger manual could E-mail me the pages that shows where
> they go on. Thanks
Yes that is right. As i posted my 1990 does not have threaded bolt holes
for the front. you NUT AND BOLT the front thru the lower control arm
side to side using the holes in the arm. use of the bolts and NYLOCK
nuts they give you with the aftermarket braces you should buy as they
are designed (factory ones dont work on all year cars like you find out)
to work on ALL the cars when you buy them is highly recomended. as for
the rear. yes you must buy a four point bolt mount brace like i did from
cannon. it does bolt like i posted to the four bolts that ARE there in
the rear suspension. and there is no way to do this with out messing up
the alignment so dont try. the point of the whole thing is to tighten up
the rear body. so doing it without getting it realigned is a waste of
time. and the brace will break too from over stress! most are designed
to be installed on a lift or at the very least off the ground loose! and
then the car lowered down on to the ground and PRELOADED! and then
tightend. if you have the alignment shop put the brace in, a very easy
thing while on a good drive on alignment rack and then align the car it
is all done in one operation and done right!.
REMEMBER! TANLINES ARE UNKEWL